Coming in to a Slick Tree After Judge Arrived; Other Coonhound News

Coonhound Advisor

June 12, 2017

Source: Allen Gingerich

As published in Coonhound Bloodlines May 2017

Coming in to a Slick Tree After Judge Arrived

Q: Dogs were cast into a small wooded hollow between two fields. Dogs A and B are struck in, in that order. Dog B trees, followed by Dog A. Dog C never struck in. Tree is closed and A and B were handled at the tree. After we had been at the tree for about three minutes, Dog C comes into general area, heads towards the cast and puts her nose on the tree but never barks or rears up on tree. Judge instructed handler to handle the dog. Tree was scored and it was obviously slick. Dog A ended up with 175- and Dog B with 200-. Dog C was assigned tree points and minused (50-). Was Dog C scored correctly?

A: How to score dogs that come in to the tree before vs. after the judge arrives seems to stump a good number of handlers. I remember it being one that personally took me a little while to stick in my head without needing to flip the card over every time one of those two scenarios came about. Finally, I figured out the easiest of the two to remember is how to score dogs that come in after the judge arrived, which is the case with Dog C. 5(b), 5(b), 5(b); every time-every day!

Rule 5 (b) always applies to any and all dogs that come in after the judge arrives. Forget about anything else for a minute. The rule states so much as the only time a dog is penalized for coming into the tree after the judge arrives is if a coon is seen in the tree. If a coon is seen, the dog is to receive its strike points minused. If the tree is scored any other way (slick/minus, circle, delete, scratched for off game), the dog receives circle strike points. This applies even to Nite and Grand Nite Champions in the event of off game. 5(b) takes precedence over any other rule, such as 6(g), where Nites and Grands are scratched for off game.

In this case, the tree was scored as being slick, so that means Dog C would receive circled strike points. However, there's another slight twist in this scenario, and that is, Dog C was shut out on strike on this tree. Matter of fact, the dog has never barked at any time, although that is a moot point. Dog C has no strike points to circle so the scorecard should simply reflect nothing other than maybe a slash, for those so inclined, through the box in the appropriate strike column box for that turnout.

When it comes to dogs treeing but not declared treed, when the judge arrives, there's a couple different rules in Section 4 that may apply. Knowing which rule applies requires the tree to be scored first. If a coon is seen, Rule 4 (f) applies, and the dog receives its strike points minused. Nothing else. If the tree is circled, the dogs strike points are also circled. Nothing else. If the tree is slick or off game is seen, Rule 4 (j) applies, resulting in next available tree points assigned to the dog, and then both strike and tree points are minused. This is the rule that they incorrectly applied to Dog C in the scenario given above. Again, this is for dogs treeing but not declared treed, and does not apply to dogs that come in after the judge arrived. If off game is seen, in the case of Nite Champions and Grand Nite Champion casts, those dogs that were treeing but not declared treed when the judge arrived are scratched right along with those dogs that were declared treed. They do not get a break like they would had they come in after the judge arrived.

Lift the Stationary Clock Anytime Another Dog is Declared Treed

Q: In a nite hunt, we had all dogs declared struck and trailing. Dog A is treeing but not declared treed. After a little while of this and the handler not declaring the dog treed, the judge started the stationary rule on Dog A. While this stationary clock is running (two minutes gone), Dog B is declared treed in the opposite direction. Question is, should the stationary clock continue on Dog A or should it be lifted?

A: The stationary should be lifted on Dog A. Anytime the stationary is applied to a dog, and another dog is declared treed on that same tree, the stationary clock is lifted and the regular five-minute tree clock takes over. UKC maintains that the stationary clock should also be lifted any time a dog is declared treed, even when that dog is not on the same tree as the dog who has/had the stationary clock applied. And focus should be turned towards the dog(s) that is declared treed. It doesn't matter whether or not the dog declared treed and the dog who has the stationary clock applied are obviously split or not.

Lets take it a step further and say that Dog Bs tree has been scored, and Dog A is still treeing in the same place, but still hasn't been declared treed. Would you apply a new full five-minute stationary clock on Dog A or only give him three minutes this time since he already used up two minutes the first time when the stationary rule was lifted? A new full five-minute clock should be applied to Dog A. Lets also use this opportunity to remind judges that they should never apply the stationary rule to a dog that they think might be treeing in the ground or in a place of refuge. The only time the stationary clock should be applied is if: 1) the dog is obviously treeing and treeing right; 2) you don't think the dogs sounds to be in a hole or place of refuge; and 3) for whatever reason the handler is not calling the dog treed.

Three Issues Pertaining to Strikes
Rule 11 (a) - Dog must open before declared struck or treed.
Rule 4 (d) - Strike points will be minused: First offense failure to strike a dog on or before the third bark, after the first minute each time dog is released, will result in those points being awarded and minused.
Rule 6 (j) - Dogs will be scratched: On second offense if handler fails to strike his dog on or before the third bark, after the first minute, each time dog(s) is released.

Q: Lets say a dog barks two times then shuts up. Twenty minutes goes by, and the dog hunts in a completely different direction and barks once. Does this count as the third bark and must the dog be struck, or is this considered the first bark again with two to go? Seems if eight minutes denotes a dead or lost track that the same should apply to a dog that has opened and not been declared struck. If a dog opens once, but is not struck, and eight minutes lapse without another bark, seems to me like the bark requirement should start over. What is the reason for the three-bark rule in the first place? If a dog opens once, and a handler cautiously refrains from striking him in on a track he cant finish, why penalize the handler by requiring him to strike on the second bark 20 minutes later? On a somewhat related topic, is it permissible to declare a dog struck 5, 15 or even 50 minutes after its last bark?

A: Neither the UKC Nite Honor Rules nor UKC interpretations of such have ever referred to a time frame or distance requirement which would in effect re-start the number of barks a dog could make before being required to strike the dog. You must strike your dog on or before the third bark regardless. While I certainly cant speak for the reason that the three-bark rule was originally adopted, I can only assume that it was put in place to hold hounds accountable for tracks that they opened on.

Playing the devils advocate, lets look at an example of how many times a hound could open without being struck in if the eight minutes actually re-set the bark requirement as you suggest. First, the dog could bark for a solid minute without being declared struck. So as not to confuse the issue, well say in our example that after the first minute, a dog opens twice but is not declared struck. Eight minutes later, he opens twice more and is not struck. And so on. Two hours later, this hound could have opened 30 times without being declared struck or penalized. And what if the dog treed a coon right off the tailgate put some plus on the scorecard then opened 20 more times the rest of the hunt without being declared struck or penalized? That would be a tough way to get beat.

In regards to your second question, you can only strike a hound that is opening on trail at that time the dog is struck. That portion of Rule 11 (a) which states, dog must open before declared struck or treed, has been interpreted by UKC to mean that a dog must be opening when the call is made. This prevents a handler from holding off on one bark and jumping in behind someone else for second strike when a second dog barks and is struck ten minutes later. If you elect not to strike him when he opens, you have to live with it when the competition is getting struck in and your dog isn't saying a word.

One more thing, its my understanding that in some parts of the country its become an issue that if you're not in the process of saying strike as your dog is in the process of making its third bark, that you will be scratched. That's not true. On the third bark means immediately following the third bark, but before the fourth, as far as UKC is concerned.